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Jake Raby is still in my eyes an arrogant man.I don't like him and never will.I told him in no uncertain terms.
When I spoke to him through e-mails,I said the exact same to him.You make one change and his "patent" is worthless.As I said before,it's not even a patent,but a patent pending only for the US.Even if I took it and copied it directly and sold it in SA as the "CTM" ( ),he won't be able to do anything about it.
Damn,I'm good!
Beach Buggy (Running and now Aircooled!)
VW TDi DC
Jetta V TDi
The question is ,has Raby threatened anyone about copying the shroud?
I have 10 that I bought from Joe before he passed away, they will be for sale. they are used,but look new. I planned on converting my stock of type4 engines all to upright and selling them complete turnkey, then the local market went to honda and subi so that isnt going to fly around here.
Vince would not sell the rights to raby so jake had someone else buy it for him. That is what I heard from a fairly reliable source.
I appreciate candid forums and hope to keep building and selling type 4 parts. Maybe I need to charge more to get more business.
Oh and I am working on a water cooled type 4 head design just for fun.
2840 turbo type4 fuel injected with a GM computer, need more tuning but runs GOOOOOOD.
The question is ,has Raby threatened anyone about copying the shroud?
I have 10 that I bought from Joe before he passed away, they will be for sale. they are used,but look new. I planned on converting my stock of type4 engines all to upright and selling them complete turnkey, then the local market went to honda and subi so that isnt going to fly around here.
Vince would not sell the rights to raby so jake had someone else buy it for him. That is what I heard from a fairly reliable source.
I appreciate candid forums and hope to keep building and selling type 4 parts. Maybe I need to charge more to get more business.
Oh and I am working on a water cooled type 4 head design just for fun.
Hey sand great to see you here! I know your STF name but since you are "sand" here, sand it is!
Don't lock your OPP shrouds away, there is a market, just maybe not the offroaders. There are street beetles that want DTM shrouds.
All, please don't think that everyone in the US is like what you see on youtube, it's not a good example. Those are just the people smart enough to operate a camera!
I'm just relieved that "Shop Talk" wasn't included in the thread title! .......yet!
Eben, I had a look at the samba thread you linked, and I can't believe the cool reception you got. Would you be so kind as to submit an identical post on the type4um? I would be honored to have your post. As you know we have many international members and a much higher tolerance for diversity.
IMPI, just like Eben, you are more than welcome (back) too!
The question is ,has Raby threatened anyone about copying the shroud?
Yes indeed, a couple of months ago on either STF or samba, Jake went all jughead and all his pets came barking as well. The thread got deleted but I think its still visible on here or on earlybay somewhere. Jake started threatening Armand(IMPI) in his absence and made all sorts of accusations. I wish I had the comparative pictures and facts at that stage but oh well....
Thanks Monte, I might take you up on your offer when I get back. I hope I don't get the same reply if you have some over-lapping members on there
I read all that stuff, very entertaining. Remember, Jake bought the shroud business AFTER it was designed and proven, so in fact his improvements have made the originals obsolete and they can be done with whatever they want.
2840 turbo type4 fuel injected with a GM computer, need more tuning but runs GOOOOOOD.
I'm sure I read somewhere that Jack in fact did not buy the design from Oregon Performance but bought it after Joe passed away... And what you say makes more sense now about someone else buying it for him....
Jake the Snake....
"My other ride is your SeatCover! & She loves it!" Sometimes you'r the statue, sometimes your the pigeon. "Only the dead go free..." Roger Waters. "You do not understand the power of the DarkSide" Darth Vader.
Don't mean to drag this into anything it's not, just wanted clear air for all that have an interest in this.
For those that care, the internals of a DTM are nothing like the internals of an IMPI shroud. I have had an early V1 DTM for years now. Why isn't it on an engine? I got distracted by something bright and shiny, several other projects.
Jake Raby is not a member of ShopTalkForums and has not been for about a year. He and Doc (owner of STF) mutually agreed that things were better off this way. Jake became comfortable on samba and the rest is history.
I am a co-moderator for the shoptalk Type4um so that is why I welcome Eben (or anyone else) to post up. We have an international interest in the type 4 motor and everything positive I can do to promote the T4 motor (and good relations) I am trying to do. I feel the need to be an American that people in other countries think better of, because it's the right thing to do. Just the fact that I am posting here on ACVWSA and I am not subject to a "samba mob" beatdown is a credit to the members of this forum for their openmindedness and goodwill. Thank you all for that. That said, I know my place and I stay out of the threads involving your country's politics or your discussions of international affairs involving my country. Fair enough I think.
Finally, one (more )bit of sad results of all this: IMPI had developed a type 4 motor into type 3 vehicle adapter that had us hopeful it would be imported to the US. I understand there was even some initial talk that Raby might be the US arm for that venture, however it's plain to see those discussions broke down somewhere along the way, and we in the US are without anyone serious about an aftermarket solution like the IMPI type 3 bellows adapter.
Sorry that went on for so long. That is about 5 different subjects rolled up into one post, but I felt I had to say it all. If anyone fell asleep I apologize.
"My other ride is your SeatCover! & She loves it!" Sometimes you'r the statue, sometimes your the pigeon. "Only the dead go free..." Roger Waters. "You do not understand the power of the DarkSide" Darth Vader.
"Good on you mate. As a fellow antipodean (oz) I recognise the enginuity and individualism of those who make what they need.
Ignore the fan boys and keep doing your own awesome thing Very Happy
Just like us Aussies do. "
Jake Raby:
"I didn't need your interjection and I didn't need your comments, you were off base by even posting and how dare you state that my defense of intellectual property is off base.
People like you are what made me realize that Armand's efforts must be contained to the best of my ability. The issue was provoked by you, so the person you had better be writing is Armand, not me.
There is use for further communication, I will forward any future efforts of yours to my counsel.
We'll see just how much "I can do about this"."
""So, are you now a representative of Armand? Excuse me, but what does any of this have to do with you? Why do you posess such interest in this? Could it be that you are a partner of Armand?
Since you are obviously in contact with Armand, please forward him this contact info as I would like to talk with him directly before persuing anything legally as we may be able to reach an agreement without those hassles
is my primary email
706 892 8192 is my direct phone number.
For years I never cared that Armand was doing any of this and more than likely I still wouldn't had this post not have been started.. The reaction of others, my customer base is what my Counsel is most concerned with.
And you'll see that OTHERS thought the system was a rip off of the DTM before I did in these threads. Thats exactly what makes the system "confusingly similar" and that is what my legal counsel is most concerned with omn top of the DTM concept also being employed in the design.
I help South Africans all the time and have lots of friends there, just last year I helped Tony Z get the parts that Serrano stiffed him out of and didn't ask for a dime...
_________________
Jake Raby
"Also, my comments were not off base. they were required. I take what we do here very seriously and when faced with a challenge I will do what is necessary to protect these things, no matter what that entails.
Armand's description of his system both directly and indirectly SLAMS my DTM and perhaps that is what bothered me most. I won't tolerate someone basing their design from my product and then slamming it to promote their own. If anything set me on a rampage, that was it and that was Armand and no one else."
My Response:
"My "damn" mouth"??
We in SA have always held you in high regard when it came to knowledge and experience.Non of you has even seen IMPI's design or made an effort to purchase one and try iy it.
You just assumed it "might be" a knock off and put IMPI's integrity in question.You,or any body else have no right to accuse,or imply that it is a knock-off,fake,rip-off,copy or patent violation.
As far as patents go,I don't think that you have registered a patent in SA,or internationally for that matter.And like you said,if IMPI did market it in the US,and IF it was a fake,copy or a violation of your patend pending,you might have had a case.As it stands,no lawyer or court would act on it,as you have no clue what his product is about.And also,if it is found that product in any way differs from yours,i.e. size,working,parts,shape or otherwise,your claim will be worthless.
My opinion,as Glenn so eloquently put it,is that Glenn went on a photograph of a shroud and put doubt into other consumers minds about the legitimacy of the IMPI shroud.What he and you are now doing is damaging to his character and business,and he has more of a case that you do.He hasn't put your product down or belittled you in any way.
I came up for him because I know what you are implying is untrue,be it the workings of the shroud or the fact that he has done his own research and manufacturing.
So go ahead,I opened my "damn" mouth,and have been called an "asshole",and that gentlemen will be exibit "A" in my case against you.The gloves are already on the floor.And I have it on record too.
Jake,I'm disappointed in you,and thought you were a bigger man than this.
Sorry I was wrong about you.You aren't so great after all.""
Damn,I'm good!
Beach Buggy (Running and now Aircooled!)
VW TDi DC
Jetta V TDi
vader wrote:I'm sure I read somewhere that Jack in fact did not buy the design from Oregon Performance but bought it after Joe passed away... And what you say makes more sense now about someone else buying it for him....
Jake the Snake....
Correct on that statement. I could go into detail but ,beating a dead horse you know. If I had known it was for sale I would be making them now.
I bought my shroud in '96, met Joe and was actually there helping him fine tune the cooling fins. I was one of the first in this area to do type4 stuff and I have been doing engines and promoting conversions since. He was a good guy willing to help most anyone. He only made around 100 shrouds and was really getting rolling when he got sick. It was a sad day for sure. His widow and sons are friends and I see them often.
Reality, there is enough work out there for everyone that wants to build good products for the sport.
2840 turbo type4 fuel injected with a GM computer, need more tuning but runs GOOOOOOD.
There is some parts I would LOOOOVE to make.... one of them is a Type3 >4 adapter that seals just around the fan opening... the second is IDF/DRLA filter housings with cold air intake connection that fits under a Type 3 lid. If only I had the tools and the workshop. I know exactly what they would look/work like but I cant manufacture in a studio flat
),he won't be able to do anything about it.
)bit of sad results of all this: IMPI had developed a type 4 motor into type 3 vehicle adapter that had us hopeful it would be imported to the US. I understand there was even some initial talk that Raby might be the US arm for that venture, however it's plain to see those discussions broke down somewhere along the way, and we in the US are without anyone serious about an aftermarket solution like the IMPI type 3 bellows adapter.
