Type 3 History

Fables and Facts from ACVW History
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Chris
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Type 3 History

Post by Chris »

April 1961
1500 Notchback, 'Station Car' and Convertible announced (convertible never entered production). Engine 1493 cc, 7.2:1 CR, 53 bhp at 4,000 rpm with side-draft 32 PHN carb; torque exceeds 80 ft.lbs between 1,500 and 2,800 rpm. 6-volt electrics, side parking lamps, variable speed wipers. Swing-axle half-shafts; twin lower full-width torsion bars on front; two brake cylinders per front wheel; opening rear side windows, central rear armrest on Notchback.

August 1963
Notchback and Variant (Squareback) available with either 1500N (54 bhp at 4,200 rpm, 7.8:1 CR, torque 83.2 ft.lbs. at 2,800 rpm, 33.5 mpg, max. speed 78 mph) or 1500S (twin carbs 32-PDSIT2/3 66 bhp at 4,800 rpm, 8.5:1 CR, torque 83.9 ft.lbs. at 3,000 rpm, 36 mpg, max. speed 84 mph). Brake lining area increased. 'N' models have single-speed wipers, no parking lights, small front indicator 'bullets', pre-heated intake air, opening quarter lights optional extra.
'S' models have extra chrome trim on side front and rear, wheel trims, passenger outside door-lock, larger rear lights and chromed reflector housing, opening rear side windows, clock, door pockets, side arm-rests and two rear ashtrays, push-button control switch panel, headlamp flashers, second sun-visor, rear interior light, passenger door mirror (Variant or Squareback). No intake air pre-heater.

August 1964
Models as in Aug 1963, except torque quoted as "over 72.3 ft.lbs. in range 1500-2800 rpm".

August 1965
Fastback introduced as 1600TL, and Variant (Squareback) 1600. New 1600 engine (1584 cc, 65 bhp, 7.7:1 CR, 86.8 ft.lbs. at 2,800 rpm, 84 mph max, 34 mpg). Front disc brakes fitted. Weighted flap pre-heater for intake air. Exhaust muffler has detachable upper heat exchangers. Trim as 1500S.

August 1967
Models now 1600A and 1600L Notchback, 1600TL Fastback, 1600A and 1600L Variant (Squareback). 1600 twin carb engine now quoted as 31.5 mpg. 'L' models have Automatic option, which includes double-joint rear axle (max speed 81 mph, 29 mpg). '1600A' models have the 54 bhp 1500 engine (!), and less trim. All models gain dual circuit brake system, 12-volt electrics, safety steering column, two-speed wipers with 15" blades, flexible plastic knobs on switches and vent-wing catches, front-seat backrest release knobs, trigger door handles, larger outside mirror, external fuel filler flap with finger-hole (non-lockable). As 'L' extras:- head restraints, HRW, hazard flashers, reversing lights.

August 1968
Electronic Fuel Injection introduced; double-joint rear axle, internal filler release, hazard flashers. FI Automatic 30 mpg. Radial tyres and petrol heater as extras.

August 1969
Long-fronted models introduced; extra luggage space, Europa bumpers, larger front flashers and rear light units, fresh air box and dashboard modified, bonnet springs replace torsion bar mechanism, inner wings gain external re-inforcement panels. 1600T, TA and TL Fastback, 1600A and L Variant (Squareback).

August 1970
1600TA and TE Fastback, 1600A and E Variant (Squareback); now with rear ventilation slots. 'E' models have FI, HRW, side trim, carpeting, passenger sun-visor, clock. Thermostatic intake pre-heater for twin carbs.

August 1971
Increased brake pad area with early 411 calipers, 'Computer Diagnosis' socket, larger bore single-piece damper/tailpipe, longer outside door-lock triggers (wiggly) and deeper door recess, black-faced instruments, four-spoke steering wheel, wash-wipe lever on column with single wipe option, anti-burst lock on Variant (Squareback) tailgate, aluminium painted indicators, cut-away corners on front bumpers.

April 1972
Centre rail seats; front footwell heater outlets controlled from tunnel. Black wiper arms and blade holders, late May 1972. Bonnet (hood) and boot-lid (trunk) badge simplified with brushed finish. No further changes in August 1972 for 1973 models.

General Features


Strengths:-
Spacious body and luggage capacity; good braking; heating air thermostats; engine and gearbox parts common to Beetle; separate body and floorpan.

Weaknesses:-
Cylinder heads crack; overheating; gearbox problems; twin-carb plugs inaccessible; rust traps are front wings, inner wings, rear lower seat-belt mounts, jacking-points, sills, spare wheel housing, later fresh-air boxes, bumper mounts.

Figures:-
Wheelbase 94.5" Track f/r 51.6"/53.2" Overall length 170.9" Height 57.9" Width 63.2" (64.6" with side parking lamps)
Weight Sedan 2227 lbs/1010 kg(unladen) 3109 lbs/1410 kg (laden)
Variant (Squareback) 2281 lbs/1035 kg(unladen) 3274 lbs/1485 kg (laden)
Trailer 1025 lbs (unbraked) 1433 lbs (braked)
Luggage Front compartment 6.5 cu ft (-1969) 7.8 cu ft (1970-)
Rear compartment Notchback 7 cu ft Fastback 12 cu ft
Variant (Squareback) 24.7 cu ft 42.4 cu ft (back seat folded)
Details extracted mainly from UK brochures; other variations were on sale elsewhere.


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Re: Type 3 History

Post by hitlers revenge »

BOFFIN!
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nerf herder
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Re: Type 3 History

Post by nerf herder »

How many Type 3's did the South Africa plant make?

I've been trying to research some Type 3 data, and it appears most websites are lying to me. Or at least not telling the whole truth. This includes the Type3Registry, TheSamba, Wikipedia...

They say there are 2.588 million Type 3's (including 43K Type 3 Ghias) made from 1961-73, but according to Wikipedia, this is German production (they're more honest about that part, but then they forgot about the ghias). The 430,000 built in Brazil from 1968-81 are in addition to that number, although they are almost a different category altogether, what with 4 headlights and such.

Then I got the book "Volkswagens of the World" by Simon Glen, and he makes the claim that there were nearly 3.5 million Type 3's made between Germany, Australia, and South Africa. I checked with the Australian folks, and they say only 26K were made there (before they went to CKD, which I think are counted as produced in Germany, but only adds another 29K anyway). So 3.5 million - 2.588 million - .026 million leaves over 800K Type 3's produced in South Africa from 1963-69 if Mr. Simon Glen is correct. Is that possible? Anybody have good numbers on this?
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Re: Type 3 History

Post by DR WATSON »

Interesting Gentlemen :D
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karmakoma
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Re: Type 3 History

Post by karmakoma »

There is no way the SA plant churned out 800 000 Type 3's in the sixties. Then we would have loads to choose from :-)

Something's fishy, please keep us up to date with your findings.
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Re: Type 3 History

Post by nerf herder »

I'm thinking the 430,000 from Brazil might be counted in that "nearly 3.5 million" number. Then South Africa's contribution would be something close to 400,000, less if the CKDs were counted twice. Remember too, that South Africa exported cars, so they wouldn't all still be in the country. But in any rate, the official Type 3 tallies that are accepted as truth apparently forget about Australia and South Africa.

I think the reported beetle numbers are probably good, because that was scrutinized pretty closely when it reached the Model T production number, and then again when it was surpassed by the Toyota Corolla. But I wonder if bus numbers and other oddball vehicles also suffer from the Wolfsburg-only blinders.
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Re: Type 3 History

Post by Ron&Gill »

It has little to do with this thread, but just for the record, the Toyota Corolla numbers are bollocks, there is no resemblance at all beween the first Corolla and the last ones. Even RWD to FWD. At least for the Beetle they were rear engine, RWD and aircooled. And as round as a bowler hat. The Corollas only carried the same name, not even the same badge.

I did write a post on Type 3 production numbers on this forum, but I'll be Corolla'd if I can find it...
1964 T34 - The Razor: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=10290
1956 T2 1b - Gill's bus: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=10948
1967 T316 - viewtopic.php?f=23&t=10931 & viewtopic.php?f=23&t=15977
2000 beach buggy - viewtopic.php?f=23&t=10915
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nerf herder
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Re: Type 3 History

Post by nerf herder »

Well, I'll be buggered. VW of SA actually came thru, and quite nicely. I'd heard that modern-day VW didn't care about the air-cooled days and pretty much forgotten all about it, so I didn't have high hopes, but I wrote to them anyway. Here's the response:
Thank you for contacting Volkswagen.

The total number of Type 3 Volkswagen units built between 1963 and 1969 was 38 232. Below is the breakdown for each year:
• 1963 – 2527 units
• 1964 – 5992 units
• 1965 – 5432 units
• 1966 – 7854 units
• 1967 – 7516 units
• 1968 – 5566 units
• 1969 – 3345 units
So karmakoma was quite right, it wasn't in the hundreds of thousands. That seems to shoot a hole in the number for global production in Simon Glen's otherwise very good book.

My tally is:
• 26,600 Australia ('63-'69): 10,660 notches; 6,170 fastbacks; 9,780 squarebacks. Then another 29,000 CKDs which I assume are counted as German made
• 38,232 South Africa ('63-'69)
• 1,339,100 German notchback/fastback (type 31)
• 1,202,900 German squareback (type 36)
• 42,500 German Type 3 Karmann Ghia (type 34)
• 431,750 Brazilian Type 3's ('68-'81), didn't follow the German body types exactly

So that's a total of 3.08 million Type 3's worldwide, 2.65 million if you don't count Brazil. That's my best understanding, but I might be proven wrong.

To help keep track of what's surviving, it would be helpful if you register your car at http://www.type3registry.com/, if you haven't done so. (I'm not affiliated with it, but obviously I appreciate statistics. There's a pretty good registry for type34's and from that they estimate maybe 5% of the razor Ghias still survive today).
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Re: Type 3 History

Post by Ron&Gill »

All the Type 3s made in South Africa were CDK, were they not?

My 1967 Notch (apparently one of 7516 :mrgreen: ) has a tag on the bonnet slam plate stating that it was "Assembled in South Africa" and "Origin West Germany".
notch tag.jpg
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1964 T34 - The Razor: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=10290
1956 T2 1b - Gill's bus: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=10948
1967 T316 - viewtopic.php?f=23&t=10931 & viewtopic.php?f=23&t=15977
2000 beach buggy - viewtopic.php?f=23&t=10915
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Re: Type 3 History

Post by karmakoma »

Can't believe VWSA got back to you, but good on them for doing so and thanks for posting the info. :hangloose:

That also tells me a RHD 63 push button notch is a rare thing indeed. Almost as rare as Ron's Razor. No pun Ron.
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Re: Type 3 History

Post by Ron&Gill »

No worries, I threw it away... I haven't shaved since December 2006... It was a Variant Razor...
1964 T34 - The Razor: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=10290
1956 T2 1b - Gill's bus: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=10948
1967 T316 - viewtopic.php?f=23&t=10931 & viewtopic.php?f=23&t=15977
2000 beach buggy - viewtopic.php?f=23&t=10915
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Re: Type 3 History

Post by beetlepower »

I wonder if VWSa can break that down between Squareback, Notchback,Fastback?
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Re: Type 3 History

Post by retrovan »

beetlepower wrote:I wonder if VWSa can break that down between Squareback, Notchback,Fastback?
Our good friend John Lemon, he is the VWSA historian, has informed me as follows on this question.....

The Type 3's sales were never split into S/wagons, sedans and Fastbacks except for the first year. Sales were as follows :
1963 to 1969 38313 (the figures include the Automatic Fastback and Variant)


hope this helps.

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